39 firefighters? Or 39 unqualified payed on call scabs? Sure, 39 firefighters sounds great, but how long did it take for the first qualified firefighter to arrive? This payed on call Northille-Plymouth department is a joke and it's truley unfortunate that nothing will change until someone gets hurt.

What is a qualified fire fighter AJ? You must mean the full time political fire fighter who make over 100 grand a year in pensions, over time, benefits, and legacy pay. Maybe the next time your house is on fire you can ask dispatch to send the "qualified" fire fighters you asked for. Have a good one.

It is also funny that 75 percent of fire departments are all VOLUNTEER.. You know those unqualified cowboys that play fire fighter just to look cool.

John,
Q: Can the word “payed” be used as a legitimate alternative to “paid”?

For example: “City of Plymouth citizens pay every year for a Fire Dept. Budget that was recklessly spent” (present) … “I paid last year” (past) … “For years, I have paid regularly”

A: There’s only one common sense in which either “payed” or “paid” can be used.

This is when the verb “pay” means to slacken something like a line or rope, allowing it to run out a little at a time. Example: “He payed out the rope to give it some slack.”

One more thing, and I'll shut up. The part of the story that none of us, including me, bothered to mention is the most important part. No injuries. Thank God for that.

Unqualified? Call me unqualified?? I have the same "qualifications" as you.... Shut your mouth.

Firefighter/PARAMEDIC anonymous

Alan, thanks for correction. I missed spelled paid twice. All I can say is if you're unhappy with the amount of taxes you pay for services maybe you should move instead of putting everyone else at risk by down grading services from a full time Advanced Life Support transporting fire department to a PAID on call department supplemented with a private ambulance company.
Harry, Certification is not the same as qualification. You may have passed your classes, but I don't find you as equally qualified as someone who performs the duties of a firefighter paramedic professionally and full time.
Frank, Im afraid your figures are off. Even if they make 100k with overtime and earned benefits, why is that an issue? What makes you qualified to determine how much they make? Or does it bother you that they make more than you? It must really bother you that a civil servant makes a fair wage for putting their life on the line to protect your property and save your loved ones. Are you upset because you don't have a pension?
And speaking of property. My house probably will burn down because all the qaulified firefighters are laid off and I'll be waiting for the paid on call people to drive to the station, wait for someone who can actually drive and operate the truck, drive to my house, and then fumble around with equipment they don't know what to do with.
Bottom line. This is a down grade. Plymouth needs a full time fire department

Emily,
I truley do not intend to bully anyone. I feel frustrated with the lack of knowledge the public has with difference between a full time professional fire department and a paid on call department. Like I said, 39 Firefighters sounds great, but how long did it take to get there??? I can assure you all 39 did not show up at once. And I can also assure you that all 39 are not showing up consistently on all emergencies. They heard fire and they all came out of the woodwork.
Speaking of consistency. Sure we got 39 on a fire. How many show up on a medical emergency in the middle of the night? The simple fact that there is no guarantee on when and who shows up should be enough to make people concerned for their community.

Plymouth Resident,

YOU'RE KIDDING! It took Fire Fighters TEN MINUTES to respond to a cond fire in Downtown PLymouth.
THAT'S TOTALLY UNACCEPITABLE! When the Plymouth Twp. Fire Fighters were working with the City of Plymouth the RESPONSE TIME WAS CLOSER TO THREE MINUTES. Thank God no one was trapped in this fire. Next time Plymouth Residents might not be so lucky.

When you call people scabs that's being a bully. I too feel frustrated about the lack of knowledge the public has when it comes to the qualifications of the city firefighters. But unlike you, I know several of them and I know their qualifications which are on par with the full time firefighters. And like you said, 39 firefighters sounds great, but how long did it take them to get there? Well let me ask you this, how long did it take plymouth township to respond to a fire recently when the breaks went out on their truck and had to call northville township for mutual aid? And how do you know all 39 are not showing up consistently for all emergencies? Are you taking count? And you're probably right when you said they all came out of the woodwork when they heard fire, but last time I checked, isn't that a good thing? Seems to me you're just mad that the city fire department is working fine without all the drama and politics from the township and at a lesser cost.

I see some good points here on both sides...... and some nonsense rhetoric.
I believe Bryan is right that both paid on call and full-time professional fire fighters are putting their lives on the line each time they enter a burning building and they both have families that worry about them. I don't believe dedication or passion to serve or amount of risk is the issue here.
I believe it is simply a logistical matter. Can a fire fighter already positioned at a station with a fire truck get to a location faster than one coming from home to the station, then to the scene? Of course they can. I don't see how that is an argument.
Qualified vs. unqualified? The paid on call fire department that my uncle served on did not require a paramedic license. But I'll hope and assume that the standards are higher here in Plymouth and all fire fighters, that both paid on call and full-time are required to have the same fire fighting and medical certifications. If that is the case, would we trust our safety with paid on call police officers? Or would we trust our money with an accountant who works part-time while working professionally as lawyer or mechanic or retail store manager? Or would we trust a paid-on-call IT person to fix our workplace's computer systems?

It makes sense to me that someone who is at a station all day, training, practicing, learning the latest techniques would be more qualified to assist me during an emergency than someone who only trains once a week for a few hours.
Not all mechanics or nurses or purchasing managers are made the same. I'll bet that a full-time nurse is often more competent/skilled/experienced than a part-time one. Yes, a paid-on-call fire department costs less than a full-time one does.
In many parts of life, you get what you pay for. I think fire fighters and EMT's are the same.
If your issue is with unions, I can understand that to an extent. They haven't always behaved responsibly. But by most accounts, including Bryan Bentley's (who I hope we can argue is probably the most reasonable, unbiased voice here. Including my own because I do tend to side with having a full-time fire dept. It just makes sense to me.), the Plymouth Twp fire fighters offered many concessions. It should also be noted that my uncle's paid-on-call department was also unionized. They were members of MAFF. Michigan Association of Fire Fighters. So not all paid-on-call departments are non-union either. I don't know if the Plymouth City FD is union or not.

Yes both on call and full-time fire fighters put their lives on the line and they should be commended for that. But the real issue here is the amount of time it took for the first engine and fire fighter to arrive at the seen. Ten minutes is not an accepitable response time for the residents of Plymouth, not when a fire doubles in size every 30 seconds. Is saving money and the B.S. politics between the Twp. and City worth putting lives at risk?

Alan,
I'm sorry if this is a sore spot for you, but the reasons full time firefighters are more qualified than paid on call(POC) are simple. This is their job. Day in and day out full time fire fighters exceed the the minimum standard that set by the state and are required to maintain a medical licensure of Paramedic. A POC department require the minimum standard and while some firefighters may have a paramedic certificate, they can not provide Advanced Life Suport under a department who does not provide that level of care such as Plymouth-Nothville. A full time department is a 24/7 operation. They can guarantee a set number of personnel and response time because the personnel is already at the station. A POC department can guarantee neither who or when will respond to an emergency. The amount of on duty and external training far exceeds a POC department. It is a daily standard for full time departments. Showing up onece a week to eat popcorn while wearing a fire dept shirts is why they are not as qualified as firefighter paramedics who hold degrees in their field and are more than likely teaching their skills to academy fire students.
I would like to be able go to my fire department on ANY day at ANY time to meet my firefighters. Not just on Thursday night or when they feel like showing up to fires.

Linda,
Again certification is not qualification. Because they have passed their class - does not make them qualified to perform. The level care they are able to provide is less than what Plymouth had before. Downgrade
When Plymouth Twp.s brakes went out enroute to a fire, you're right, they called Northville Twp. Another full time department. Fully staffed and ready to go. I didn't see them call the city because who knows how long it would have taken them to respond. Or if they could respond at all.
The response to the "blaze" yesterday is insulting. 39 show up for a fire. Am I guaranteed 39 for my emergency?? Or are fires the only emergency worth their time?
The department is not working "fine" as you put it. All I see are inconsistencies and inadequate services.

As a city resident I don't have a problem with the part-paid firefighters. The only disgruntled people are those who lost their job due to an incompetent union. Too bad they won't get their jobs back.

Emily,
While I respect your opinion on the current format of the fire department, I have to disagree. As a citizen myself, I have a hard time putting all my trust in a paid on call staff with the type buildings and number of citizens in Plymouth. Our downtown is far to expansive for a paid on call department to handle. The size of some of the homes in Plymouth are far to much for a firefighter with no other training besides an academy. The amount of pride Plymouth takes in its downtown should be matched in a fire department that can handle it.
How supportive are you willing to be of a paid on call fire department if Plymouth endures a tragedy that could have been mitigated? Or does it not matter as long as nothing happens to you?

Linda , what scare tactics are you talking about? FACT it took the City fire department 10 MINUTES to respond to a fire less then a 2/10 of a mile from the fire station. As you put it your in support of what the city is doing so I conclude, that either you work for the city or you have a family member that does or your hopeing it takes less the 10 minutes for them to respond to your emergency. No scare tactics here just the fact 10 Minutes is not acceptible! Not for the residents of Plymouth.

Fact Kevin, it did not take 10 minutes for them to respond. More like 8. And what is the average response time for plymouth township? About the same. Again, scare tactics which are not acceptable. Get your facts straight before trying to scare people with false information.

You can't compare one departments average with another departments response time to a single call. What you can do is compare the times for both departments to arrive at an incident 2/10 of a mile from their stations. I guarantee the full time department gets there faster.
An 8 min arrival time to an incident 2/10 of a mile away is laughable. Or should I say Scary.

Linda, please. In the Observer Hometown Life, Northville Fire Department Lt. Jason Jordan was quoted as saying “THE FIRE WAS REPORTED JUST BEFORE 5PM AND THE FIRST FIREFIGHTERS ON THE SCENE ARRIVED IN A PUMPER TRUCK 10 MINUTES AFTER THE CALL CAME IN”. The fact is it took 10 minutes again no scare tactics here. When the Plymouth Twp. was working with the City response time was under four minutes and I know this first hand. Last year to the month The Meadows Condos caught on fire, the response time for the firefighters was well under four minutes and lucky for my neighbor who was trapped in her condo and was alerted by the police and rescued by the firefighters from her 2nd floor balcony. If it would have taken eight minutes as you say or ten minutes as I have said I don’t believe my neighbor would have survived without the quick response. So let’s agree to disagree and hope and pray that our families aren’t faced with a life or death situation and the response time is eight or ten minutes for the fire department.

Linda
FOR GOD SAKES UNDERSTAND EIGHT MINUTES IS UNACEPITABLE for a fire response time. And to hell with the City Manager was he there to take the 911 call? did he show up to fight the fire? or was he at the fire sine to look good as he did at the Meadows fire last year. It seams you have all the answers and ever the Lt. was wrong. You must work for the City or have family that does. Sorry for you.

Thank you for commenting on our story. A comment was deleted for violating our terms of agreement. Feel free to have an open dialogue about the topic but please refrain from personal attacks.

A real game of 'Clue' we have here. I predict Chief Alan Cox, in the fire house.... with the popcorn machine. Good night neighbors.